Welcome to zombies trains the podcast where we watch all of the zombie movies in order this episode and MST3K special 1963's monstrosity.

No, I've seen people act like that in pictures. What do they call them? Zombies or something?

Zombies.

What's a zombie?

Just what is a zombie?

Well, a zombie, there's Mr. Bill, there's...

The living dead.

There's a living dead.

There's the zombies.

It's an army of zombies. Because a zombie has no will of his own.

What is wrong?

What is wrong?

Welcome to zombie strains. I am as ever, John.

I'm Andy

And I'm Brad.

Hello, producer, Brad. How are we doing today?

Good.

Can I just say it's is genuinely remarkable to me that in the space of one month, we have gone from a criterion collection, all-time classic film. Yes, and we're still in the same genre. Like I, Yeah, and we have a, and he and I had a mutual friend who who listens to the podcast and he doesn't watch every movie, but he decided to watch Carnival of Souls and he just was posting about it endlessly about how great he thought it was and so, you know, sorry to disappoint you Joel, if you're listening to this one, you don't have to watch my stress. I had a different time to tell my hand. I had a different friend told me he watched Carnival Souls and he was like, I think you guys might be suffering from Stockholm syndrome. Yeah. he's so wrong about that you know what I've discovered I don't consider myself particularly educated about movies and film and like I'm trying to learn more that's part of this podcast but like like I know what the criterion collection is even if I don't own any blue rays in order to mean and and I mentioned that just off hand to somebody and they're like a What? The what collection? I'm like, you know what, never mind. Never mind. So that's great. All right. Well, today we're talking about monstrosity. We can't avoid it forever. But before we do that, do we want to talk about any zombie related or movie related stuff we got going on? I have a couple of things. I don't have much zombie related stuff outside the podcast going on at the moment to my deep regret. How about you, John? Well, I got a couple of things. So I'm going to show this to my co-host, but you guys won't be able to see it. It's a box set of little zombie figurines. There's five of them. My daughter purchased them for me and they're like, four inches tall and you can take them apart. Their heads come off and then they're interchangeable. So you can put like the head from one zombie on a different zombie. Whoa. The arms and legs come off. Yeah. So, what were they released for? What is this part of a product line? Now it's like a general, I think they're English. No, they're made in China, BOH toys. It's some off-off brand, but it does say zombie in five languages on the back. You can, there you go, there's the picture on the back. Figure us, dismbies, in any case. So that was delightful. And then I bought, I didn't buy, I got a subscription to speaking of the criterion channel last week. It was only 1099 and there are three. So I don't know if anybody knows about the criterion channel, if I assume most of you do, if you don't, that's OK. the way they do it is it's not like Netflix with every huge library they have a curated selection of films they have some permanent films but mostly it's about for the next three months this is what we've got so the next three months is is film noir, things like the big sleepers on there, which is the first movie I watched. And then on top of that, there's, they have Howard Hawks directed films, and then the third thing was Hong Kong action movies. So John Wu basically, all the John Wu films. So I was like, okay, I'm in. You can have me for a month. We'll see how this goes. Yeah. And it's not there much, it's like 11 bucks per month. So I'm not gonna complain. All right, contact us. Criterion collection for sponsorships. Yeah, absolutely. Yep. Yeah, the next one. First one's free, Criterion. This one, just like Toby. We're waiting for Toby to call back. We're now waiting for Criterion to call back as well. So how about you, producer, Brad? Anything good? I am watching Plurvis and Apple, and it's only seen when episode. So I don't know what genre it is, but I think it's interesting. All right. And then along the lines of us talking about low budget crappy movies, I watch a really high budget movie recently, which is crappy. I watch Howard the Duck. If you remember that. Oh, wow. That's famously disaster. Yeah. What was the inspiration? I saw it online. I hadn't seen it in years and I go, it can't be as bad as I remember it and it was bad. It was really bad. I think that about Ghostbusters 2 once every five years. I'm like, I can't be that bad, right? I can't be what I remember it. And then I watch it and it's like, oh, yeah, that's that's a really good. I put up how are the DAC versus those busters 2 and I think I would that's some that's a tight competition All right, we'll have it that'll be our next podcast. We'll have a that's right a watch off between terribly finally remembered films So all right, well, let's talk about 1963's monstrosity Brad you want to kick us off and tell us how this thing mate was unleashed on the world of course. So monstrosity, also known as the atomic brain, was released in September of 1963 by Emerson Film Enterprises. At least that's when IMDB listed as the release date. Decades later, the films producer Jack Pollux, and remembered monstrosities coming out in 1964. Pollux Finn also said the movie was shot in 1958 with a budget of $40,000, but the production company ran out of money and they had to stop halfway and they spent years trying to fix it with editing and as we witnessed, I don't think they succeeded. He said everything went wrong while making this film and as the only film he worked on that didn't make any money. Emerson film enterprises release mostly exploitation in horror films. Manos, the hands of fate is one of Emerson's most infamous releases and is often with goodness. Do you know that film? Yeah, from Mystery Science Theater three. Yes, yes, and his often lists is when the worst movies ever made. It doesn't have to be. Tell me it doesn't have zombies in it. I haven't seen it. Andy. I don't even remember. I'm sure we could shoot Hornet into this podcast if we needed to. I'm saying, let's not. I'm saying don't. I'm saying. Well, to give you an idea of other films that Emerson released, they titles like The Touchables, Dr. Playgirl, how to succeed with girls and the sex terminators, which is from 1970, so it's not a rip-off of the Terminator. Wow. Okay. So the Terminator is a rip-off of that movie. That's what I'm interested in. Well, I looked it up. The sex terminators is set in a world where pro-creation is police, and one man goes rogue and wants to have as much sex as he can. got to take one for the team. I get it. This is just going to time Danny to mention this is a very exploitative film that really does any excuse to can to put women in their underwear. So anyway, carry on. Joseph V. Muskelly directed. This is his only film as director, shocking. At some point during the film, the producer Pollux van fired Muskelly and he then finished the film as director, but it was uncredited. Miskele does have six credits as cinematographer in one of these films is on our list and it's coming up. Don't spoil it. I don't want to know. It's coming up real quick. Miskele was a cinematographer for the U.S. Army during World War II. After the war he continued as a civilian cinematographer and was hired by the Air Force. IMDB credits miskele as a cinematographer for the aerial footage of the first hydrogen bomb test on bikini atoll. Oh, wow. In 1965, Miss Kelly wrote a book called The Five Seas of Cinematography. It is a highly regarded book that teaches the classic techniques of cinematography and it is still read today. And he started here. I mean, is it based on like having the camera just ogled, scantily clad women? Is that like what the book is about? I hope the book talks out being in focus because there's so many shots in this film where the focus was not present. I actually had a backtrack once I'm like, wait, is that simply? Do they just not focus the shot? There's this whole scene anyway. Here I thought that was like some sort of artistic choice, so you guys are disillusioning me on this last piece. Well, when the wall is in focus and the people in the foreground are not, I think that's not the way it's supposed to be. Monstrosity has three credited writers, two of whom are women, And as an example of how low budget this movie is, both have multiple credits on monstrosity. Sue was also the script supervisor and assistant camera and both vines Sue, did the wardrobe and props. This was the last film credit for vime. Sue continued to work in production as a production coordinator and production secretary and many well-known films like the French connection, deliverance, slap shot, and eat the extra terrestrial. Okay, wow. That's amazing. Some people can escape. Now, this is only the second film we have watched that was written by a woman. Do you guys remember the first and only other film? No, I was going to make wild guess, but I don't want to. Yeah, I can't guess either. I'll give you a hint. We've had two really exploited films. Maniac? Maniac. No. 1834. Whoa. Oh, you're kidding. Build a guard's lady wrote that her husband was the director if you recall. Oh, okay, yes, that comes back to me now. Feel so uncomfortable having this burned out. Well, I think in the margins of the industry is where people find opportunity sometimes, unfortunately, Dean Dilman was a third writer and monstrosity is his only writing credit. What do writers? I mean, this movie had multiple writers. Like, was, my mind is a little boggling right now. So, sorry, carry on. That's a good question. And there is a blue ray out there for this film. And there's there's some documentaries. I don't have access to it. But maybe there's some information there. We can look it up. I should have checked the criteria in channel before joining our recording session. Yes. Jean Cower composed the music. He is 49 composer credits, many in the low budget world, but he also did the music for the Gumby TV show. Well, he's listed as some of the episodes, not all. And all three faces of death movies. Oh, that's the first question. Congratulations. I did know that this soundtrack leans into the bassoon a whole lot. So I feel like you're watching a cartoon with people in it. It would be based on the soundtrack. It's very strange. Yeah, every time I hear bassoon, I think Andy now. Yeah, Alfred Taylor was the cinematographer. The last film he did was in 1988. I'm sure you've heard of it. Killer clowns from outer space. I saw that on the right up. Yes, that was a before. I don't know. I feel like I'm about to sound like an old man, which I probably do all the time anyway. But like before people intentionally made bad movies, we just had bad movies. And this felt like it was intentionally bad, but also, I don't know, it was just such a cult classic. Now, over the course of the 40 movies we have watched, spanning 1932 to 1963, we have seen and commented a lot about the mad scientist labs and the repeating tropes of arching electricity and Tesla coils. Right. Well, we just doubled on to the man responsible for much of this. Wow. Really? I saw that, too. Sorry. Ken Strickfeldt and designed and built Dr. Frankenstein's lab for the 1931 Frankenstein. He then did the lab for brighter Frankenstein. He did flash Gordon, and he did the wizard of Oz. For over 50 years, his equipment was used in films for futuristic and mad-scientist labs. It is strict fattings equipment that makes up the mad-scientist lab in monstrosity. In the 70s, Mel Brooks used strict fattings equipment for young Frankenstein to recreate the original. That's amazing. Rank this guy up with the guy who was the gorilla suit. Yeah, exactly. Right. The guy who was the mad scientist lab equipment. That's amazing. Ben Bert, the sound designer for Star Wars, wants a strict fadden to record his electrical equipment and then sprinkled these sounds throughout the Empire Strikes Back, return of the Jedi in Raiders of the Lost Ark. Amazing. You can hear the effects when the arc of the covenant is opened in Raiders and the Emperor's forced lightning bolts in return of the Jedi. Oh, and in the show notes, I've added a link to a short YouTube documentary on strict fadden. Oh, cool. All right, onto the cast, Marjorie Eaton plays the villain. Mrs. Hart. Our favorite, Marjorie. Yes. You remember where we saw her from, Andy? Zombies of Moritao. She was grandma. Yes, and she is the severed to bread's greatest trivia delivery so far in this podcast. Yes, I suppose you could deliver it again, but it wouldn't happen. Well, it's still the fact I brought up because it's worth it. She, her biggest claim is she is one of two women filmed wearing special effects makeup to portray the emperor in the Empire Strikes Back. That's right. Well I will just say in both of the films we have watched her and she has just like this core of steel to her personality, she would have been a really intimidating real life grandma I think. I think she's a good villain which she is in this movie. Frank Gerstle plays the mad scientist, Dr. Frank. We saw him in the four skulls of Jonathan Drake. He was a police forensic scientist in that film. You said at that time that he was like the science guy, and I recognized him immediately as like the science guy. I don't know if you noticed, but I think in their efforts to fix the film, they kept flipping the frames, because he has this diagonal scar on his forehead. Sometimes it's on the right, sometimes it's on the left. That's a good, that's a good catch. I did not see that. I didn't catch any there. Yeah. He is the most accomplished actor in the cast with over 200 credits. He's a total pro in this, I just like to say that the film is stinking up the place around him. You do not see him holding his nose. He definitely has an aura of like I'm the only professional on this set. Though I would say except Marjorie Eaton who I found delightful as well. So that's his great. Erica Peters plays Nina. She was born in Germany and after moving to the U.S., she tried to make money by importing used Volkswagen. She would buy VW's new in Germany, drive them to a ship, have them delivered to the U.S. and that customs declared them used. This is an old trick, by the way, and Cardiola is doing it again. Can I talk for 10 seconds or not this trick? So during the Second World War in particular, there was a rule about there were so few cars. uh... because all manufacturing had gone to the military industrial complex that the uh... government put strict uh... guidelines on how much you can sell a new car for right so you can exploit users so what car salesman would do is buy new car driver on the block call it used in double the price so anyway that's an old this is an old saw from that is incredible coming from car dealers who would have thought Sorry, Gary. Well, that's right. And because she wasn't a car dealer and didn't have a license, she was forced to stop that business. I read a little about her. She's actually pretty dynamic. Like she was German and fled the Red Army and ended up in the US. Like her story could make a movie, actually. She has a pretty neat woman. She then did a lot of fundraising and activism for animal rights. Yes. All right, John, for you, Judy Bamber plays B. Hold on a second. Are you about to tell me what I think you're going to tell me that she's the mother of Apollo? No. No. Okay. Jamie Bamber played Apollo and Battlestar Galactica and her last name was Bamber. I got excited. Well, no, because my next sentence would clear that up for you. She was born in Ann Arbor, Michigan. Oh, okay. And that, as I recall, Jamie Bamber is British. He is. And she plays a British person though, right? Yes, but her accent does change throughout. She's not British, clearly. Yeah, so I watched this on YouTube. And the first comment on the YouTube video I watched was the English woman's accent, we go from Essex to White Chapel to Brisbane with dizzying speed. I don't know anything about British accents, but I'm guessing it wasn't super authentic. Yeah, she's actually the same age as my mother or was, but my mother has passed away and I assume she has as well, but yes, they're both born in 1936 though my mother was not born in Ann Arbor, Michigan. Now, and she did modeling and Detroit that moved to Hollywood. She was a pin-out. She has 15 acting credits over six years and Roger Corman's a bucket of blood is her most memorable. She had a small role in that. Now, the only other actor in this film who has a lot of credits is the narrator Bradford Dillman. Yes, and you guys have probably seen him before without knowing him. He did have a long acting career starting in 1955 and lasting until the 90s when he made several appearances on murder she wrote. He was in two dirty Harry movies, the enforcer and set an impact both times, playing the police captain who braids Harry and his methods. And to help remind you, You're a dinosaur, can I hand? Your ideas don't fit today. Just what ideas are these? That murder is a crime that it shouldn't be punished? Hey, don't you like to me, you son of a bitch. You know who you're talking to? You know my record? Yeah. you're a legend in your own mind. Oh, classic. Now in those two films, he played different characters. So he was brought back to recreate the captain's role both as a different person. That's amazing. I just as an aside, I watched the good, the bad, and the ugly with my son last night. Clint Eastwood at 35 is just such a shock in it now. He versus 95. Yeah, versus 95 still going. Oh man. Well, we'd notice on the poster that the cat had a credit as there is, but the actual name is Xerxes. Yeah, I was going to say it's Xerxes. When they're read it again, I was like, there has to be Xerxes. Because he's named after the Poison King, right, Andy? Xerxes, the Poison King of Persia? Sorry, Kirion. I was trying to go. I was trying to go history with Andy and he just gave me a blank look. So yeah, I'm sorry giving you a dead ice there. Well, the Xerxes was Judy Bambar's cat. So it was on the address. Oh, alright. Nice. I had a cat that looked just like Xerxes in this film. Now you mentioned monstrosity. Oh, we should also mention that in the course of doing the research for the cell. So we discovered that there is an internet movie cat database. Yes. So which was awesome. I'll put that in the show notes. And it's delightful. Like for example, if they're review or their discussion of the cat in the movie has spoilers, they give it the cat out of the bag warning, I strongly encourage everybody to get a cat movie database for their any like tidbits about this cat. are not really not really no okay it's just a cat that I'm curious what's the first cat to get an actual credit is because this cat has a credit on the poster well I did check they do have maniac on their list so they go back to 1934 I'm still a little bit worried about the well-being of that cat from maniac but yeah you mentioned monstrosity was featured at mystery science theater 3000 it was not listed in the top 100 uh there was a musical main of this film called the atomic brain and it's similar in style to the little shop of horse. I couldn't find any evidence of it being produced. There's just a website where you can access the the score and the script. So hang on so was this a musical made like that ironically presented this or did it do it like with a straight face? Well, because it's described as little shop of horrors, I have to assume it's sort of it's extremity. It's a comedy. Yes. Yeah. All right. That would be the correct way to do this movie on this stage. But yes, now this movie is not in the criterion collection, but the YouTube version we watched looked really good, didn't it? It didn't actually. I didn't think about until you just said it, but it looked very clean, no like pops or anything. Turns out, in 2018, there was a Kickstarter campaign to fund a 4K restoration of this. Wow. And the same guy who did it also didn't mount those, the hand-of-hate. Mm-hmm. And so that's why there's a blu-ray out for this. It's from this, from that campaign. Could I just apologize for something I just did? I was just judging people for wanting to make a blue ray or a 4K restoration of this. And here I am watching it and talking about it on a podcast. So let me just take all of that. I mean, I am still judging those people. So I don't know. I think it's Nathan. There are people out there who like to preserve. Yes. Good and bad. And because everything's part of the history, and we said no, it. Yeah, for sure. That's why we're doing this podcast. So there you go. That is great. And do we want to do, I feel like we don't need a historical context to this. So this one is a little muddled historically, filmed in the 50s, released in the 60s. I don't think we're going to get a lot out of talking about historical events. So let's just skip that for now, refer you back to our recent episode on the 1960s, for the sorts of themes and questions we're looking at. I don't really know if those are going to apply to this one, Yeah, and the fact what we'll do is when we get to the end and we have the questions about the 50s I'm still going to ask that set because this really feels like a 50s movie I think so yeah next week we came up with if you've listened to last the last episode and in I came up with or really Andy let's be honest came up with some questions about the 1960s and how movies will change. So we'll start. We'll kick those off next week with our next film, which I don't know the name of yet because producer Brad doesn't tell us. Yes, stay tuned to the end of this episode where we all learn together. All right. Anything else we got to do before? Well, Andy, do you want to do a 60 second summary before we get into the details here? I'll do my best. So, monstrosity is a film about a sinister old woman. And here I just want to call out our earlier discussion from a few episodes ago about the Hagsploitation genre. That was on my mind. Yes, this is film in the 50s released in 1963 when the Hagsploitation genre got it start. Fearless, very comfortably set in that genre. At any rate, we have the sinister Mrs. Marsh. or March. March. Mrs. March is employing a mad scientist in the basement of her mansion. She wishes to be reborn into the body of a beautiful young woman in the prime of her life. Dr. Frank is the mad scientist she's employing and he thinks he's pretty close to being able to transplant the brain of one human into the body of another. However, his experiments to date have not been 100% successful, shall we say. And so this is the movie of three beautiful young women hired to work at the March Manchin, but unbeknownst to them, they are candidates who will be the body that Mrs. March or will they become the next incarnation of the evil and greedy Mrs. March listen on to find out. Did I miss anything crucial in my overview there? No, I miss his march is played by Marjorie Easton who we talked about at the very top and she's a delightful villain. she is she's a great villain like she's this might be her natural I mean I appreciate her role in zombies of more a town as a not hero exactly but as a sort of wise but a very pragmatic old person I thought that was a pretty good role for but I think she comes into her own as just a huge jerk in this movie So thank you for that summary, Andy, before we get into it, we don't we haven't been doing trigger warnings lately. We may bring them back when the movies get especially gross, but I want to mention this it is a pretty exploited of it's an exploitation movie right at the goal of this film is to is to show attractive women in his little closest they can get away with right so. yes there's points where there's like these you know those bands that they used to hold Frankenstein on the table uh you know there's there's women undergoing an atomic process to transfer their brains or whatever and their their nude except for those bands covering their private stuff like that and and you know just excuses to get women to address that's what this movie is about though you made an interesting point during our little pre show which is that it's fully aware of the predictive women in society like Mrs. March is like, you know, I at one point is like, I want people to find me attractive. Nobody listens to me. Nobody cares about me anymore. because I'm an old woman, so I'm taking advantage of these young women to become important and special again. So it has this dual awareness of the sort of misogyny and sexism of society, but then it's also like, hey, let's just, let's just be a misogynist movie. I'm glad you brought that up, John. I think it's a really interesting point that is often really hard to disentangle trashy exploitative films from films that like have a, I would say, kind of progressive awareness of self-awareness of what they're doing and the themes that they're talking about. So like you say, this is a movie that talks about like very legitimate themes like the, how Hollywood treats women who age and how society looks at women who age and how we value women based on their appearance. These are all interesting themes. They would be really good subject matter for a serious film. But instead we're seeing that subject matter handled by a film that also wants you to ogle these attractive women in various states of undress. So yeah, you know, a clever, aware, self-aware movie that is talking about themes that are kind of ahead of its time. Maybe yes. Is it a trashy piece of garbage that just wants you to look at these the at women's skin? Also yes. So I would say the first one is maybe this one is probably. Yeah, so I mean, I have a feeling if we were to look, you know, Not all the movies we've watched, most of them have not been exploitation movies, but the feeling if you explored the history of exploitation film, you would find an uncomfortable balance between awareness of these serious themes and also at the same time that you were being invited to join these films at the bottom of the barrel, right? Yeah. I also wonder if you have a company that makes exploitation films, hires two women to write it. They say, yes, we'll make you your exploitation film. But then they sneak in this other point of view about what really happens to women. Yeah, you could, you could be right about that in the director who has, maybe has no tone for this, just missed it, right? Right. Yeah. Well, you know, what do you do with a film like this? I mean, I think you could make a case that this film is subverting its own tropes. Right. I think you could also make a case that this film is just wallowing in those tropes and I I don't know enough about the history of this type of film to say which is which I'm going to lean on the side of this film mostly wants to wallow in the tropes, but it is it is undeniable that there is some intelligence behind some of these themes. Yeah, and I think, you know, not to look too far ahead, throughout the 60's 70's and 80's, I think we're going to run into characters of strong women who are also treated, you know, who are treated misogynistically and and these complex competing ideas when we get into slasher films. Yeah, this is like the highlight of this is like the pinnacle of this like we haven't been behaving in an independent way and suffering for it after we see them in their underwear. Right, so this is where this is here to stay, but it's interesting that it's so prominent in this movie. Yes, and I mean, this is the most salacious film we have seen since many. I think so too. Yeah, and it's not like it's it don't. We're not like bunch of prudes. It's not like full full nudity or awkward or anything. It's just the intention of the film is to be exploited. Yeah, I mean, this is PG right by any modern standard for sure. This is this is Tuesday night TV right, but compared to mainstream movies of the time it's pretty extreme. Yeah. So let's stop teasing our audience, John, you're going to lead the discussion for a monstrosity. Do you want to get us started on the actual film? Well so it opens with a monologue. We see Dr. Frank who we heard about at the beginning of this film and he's conducting an experiment on a corpse that he's dug up of a beautiful young woman and there is a narration that tells us everything that's going on including things like um it's trying to sort of scare the audience at one point it mentions like like the first artificial organs have started to be used and in fact this doctor's going to transplant a brain into somebody and this is happening right now and you don't even know it's going on like it's this huge paranoia and fear of science and it has it seems like a documentary feel that like almost I think we talked about with like plan nine for matter space where it's Yeah, it reminds me, I think when we covered Dr. Blood's coffin, we talked about the history of organ transplants, and I think it's worth noting that that was a pretty new and maybe scary concept to people who were watching this film in 2003. Yeah, and this film is certainly trying to scare people about it. For sure. Yes. The intro also talks about how they use an atomic process, to transfer the brain. They don't really, it's a little hand-wavey. They drop the dead body into a bat and it comes back up a skeleton. But the doctor, Frank, at the end of this, realizes, and I almost clip some of this narration, but it's so long, you know, I have another clip that has a little narration and later that I'll play for everybody. This narrator, I mean, so after about the first 10 minutes of the film, the narrator mostly drops into the background. However, for the first 10 minutes, it is like 99% narration. And like I don't know, if this was an artifact of like the trying to edit this into coherent film, they realized they simply had to narrate this or people wouldn't understand what was happening. But it's this is a tell not show film. Yes, exactly. And how is the narrator's grammar? He did find it because they weren't trying to They weren't trying to do any sort of fancy documentary style approach. They didn't twist themselves into a knot, the way that past narrators have done. Yes. In particular, you're talking about invisible invaders. Invisible invaders. Yes. And plan 9 from out of space, I believe also fell into this trend. 100%. So, well, because his experiment didn't work, he needs more subjects. So, what do you do? You go grave robbing, right? And hey, John, why was his experiment not working? Oh, I don't know. Why was this experiment? Well, this is something I feel like we've seen in other films, maybe I pretty sure we've seen it in the frozen dead, which is later than this film. But his experiments are failing because the human brain begins to deteriorate instantly upon death. Okay. And so even if the corpses he's getting are only like a Okay. All right. So this will be the justification for needing a live person. That's right. Exactly. So it's clear that this is like an old atomic thing. And he has to wear this huge radiation suit. Yes, he does. Which I just have a quick question yet. His subject doesn't. And so I don't know how their body doesn't get completely destroyed and irradiated. But we're not. I'm The movie doesn't care. Are you suggesting that the writers of this film did not adhere to the highest standards of consistency and scientific accuracy John. Yes. Okay. Okay. So we go grave robbing and he's got to find a new body, which he does. However, he's almost caught by the night watchman. the narrator's telling us all this about the poor night watchman who's 60 years old and he just tucked into a quiet corner to get a drink and and uh then they thought for this guy I just got it too and so they got so our our doctor is like opening a crypt uh to get his his new find out but um he has a guard that we didn't know about before what happens to the night watchman Andy Well, when the night watchman starts to follow the sounds he's hearing of someone breaking into the crypt of another beautiful young woman's corpse, he is attacked by someone I refer to and I notice the dog man, maybe you could stretch this in column aware of wealth, but he's a person with some genuine makeup on his face to make him look like a dog or a wolf. Which is interesting because what has happened to him, we find out later, is that they took a dog's brain and transplanted it into his body, which doesn't explain why his teeth got sharper and he now has facial hair like a wolf, so it's a great question. But back at the house. Yeah, can I just say, so like in a minute, we're going to learn that this dog man is one of the doctors, they describe it as a failure, although I, I would say from like a purely scientific perspective, this is a pretty remarkable, like yeah, but this is a failure, but he's kept him this dog man around because he's at he obeys the scientist slainishly. Yes. Yep. So they get a body. They kill the night washman poor guy. They go back to the house. And this is where we learn that Mrs. March has invited some women to come stay with her. And she's pretty obvious about the whole thing. She has a sidekick named Victor. who's not really her husband, but is like helping her do things because she's in a wheelchair. I thought he was her husband. Yeah, but I think it's like a marriage of convenience. I'm not sure. So we've got Mrs. March, Victor, and Dr. Frank. Those are the three sort of main people. And they've invited these three women and she's just very explicit about like, I need photos of these women. I need to see what they're like. So I can so that I can choose which body I want, but they've invited them here to obstecilate to care for Mrs. March. That's how they lure them. So there's one from I think they say Norway, though, that's Nina and she's German. Then there's one from England and one from Spain, I think, though, she might be from Mexico. Yes, so for Mexico. A couple things. First of all, I just went to my And I think they could have just shown a clip of Mrs. March reviewing job applicants based on their appearance. Yes, like yeah. Secondly, so yeah, so we need these three women who have been hired to ostensibly be Mrs. March assistance, but we know they're really being tried out to see which one of them can have her brain implanted into them, right? Correct. Uh, did you notice they pronounced Nina's name as Nina? Yes, Mrs. March says Naina. Naina? I went. Yeah. I did. I went to a long internet rabbit trail this, but basically the name Nina can be found in many cultures going back literally thousands of years and none of them pronounce it Naina. So. It reminded me of an earlier movie where someone pronounced someone was talking to a character named Ramon and pronounced their name as Raymond, do you remember I think that was maybe Voodoo Island I think it might have been the Ghostbreakers it could have been that yeah, you're right so Anyway, and I don't think the actress who is ostensibly from Spain, I do not think she really speaks Spanish based on the handful of Spanish language phrases. She says which are not pronounced correctly. So, right. Just don't let out. Yeah, the only convincing accent is is nine as, but it's a German accent, but it at least sounds genuine. So, yes. Yeah. Even though she's supposed to be from Scandinavia. Anyway. But here we get a couple important things in the scene as they lay out the whole plot and plan. So first off, we get checkoffs, atomic, powered self-destruct mechanism introduced in this scene where the doctor says, look, if the police come and find us, I have a mechanism here where I flip this switch and I close this breaker and this whole thing goes up and flames, which Mrs. March warns him about. But, you know, Victor sort of skeptical and Mrs. March is sort of defending Dr. Frank. So everything I just talked about, let's hear a clip of that. The doctor transferred it to the brain from a live doctor to a dead human body. You saw the creature walk out of that cylinder alive. How many failures, since then? You're a joe, honey. The body was depressed. This specimen is excellent. I will believe the lucky brother body's statue. I don't look for cemetery doctor. Final Fest was essential for your protection. As for the police, if they come here, I hit this switch and nuclear reaction is set off. Close the circuit breaker. Huh. Send it a matter of minutes. This house and any evidence of my campaign becomes a radioactive hole in the grid. Oh, careful. If you can wait for that, I'll have to wrap it up. I'm not feeling so long. So I have several things here. First of all, Victor and Mrs. March criticizing him for the holes in his plan have just neglected to mention that they posted advertisements for three women who are soon going to go missing. So, you know, so they have this kill switch, which will literally nuke the mansion if the police arrived. Yes. I've heard of people setting up like kills which is on their computer which will like fry a hard drive or something like that if the authorities show up. I don't I don't think one that nukes your house is like I does they just need to think about this. Yeah that feels like that are they going to get out are they just going out in a blaze of glory? Yeah I think that's all here just like the the lecture about organ transplants, the atomic power stuff is here just because it's a scary thing in 1958 slash 1963 and they want to exploit the terror of that for sure. Again, we talk for a second. So I do think one of the more interesting relationships that this movie puts forward is the one between Mrs. March and her ostensible quasi-husband Victor. Yes. And I genuinely think that the writers were doing something a little interesting with this. and Mrs. March's plan of course is to be reborn into a youthful woman's body. Victor is in on this deal, specifically because he's excited at the idea of having sex with a young woman instead of old Mrs. March. And this movie, I think, is our first movie. to just come right out and mention sex in the actual dialogue. Am I wrong about that? You could be right. I haven't really had my eye on that, but you're probably right. And I think what's funny about that is also, that's kind of Victor's motivation. Yes, it is. It's entire motivation through this movie. He can be manipulated. through his desires to have sex with younger women, which the protagonists are going to try to use to their advantage. But I wanted to say, I mean, the interesting thing here is that Victor also has these moments of realization, where he's like, when my old wheel chair bound wife, Who is described by many people in this movie as ugly, although I don't that that is all it that always seemed a little egregious Yeah, when she's in the body of like a gorgeous young 25 year old She will have no use for me because why would she want to hang around or sleep with like a gross 70 year old ledge right right right so yeah, it is a little it is a little interesting But Victor has no nuance to him about that now Um, so then we cut to a Pan Am flight landing at the airport, uh, Boeing 707, maybe it's maybe a 720, uh, and, uh, we meet our three women who are sort of on a bench together, um, and they are Nina B, and what's the, um, Mexican woman's name? Anita. Yes. Are we going to call her Nina? Are we going to do what the film does? Call her Nina. I can't, I don't think I can call her Nina. Okay, we'll call her Nina, just know that the film does not. Right. So three women, I think they say Vienna, England, and Mexico. Correct. And Anita speaks almost no English. Correct. And they meet on a bench outside the airport and connect as young women trying to figure out. And they they figure out immediately. Oh, we're all three going to the same place. Isn't that strange? Yes. Victor comes to pick them up. It is. station wagon, which looks enough like the Ghostbusters station wagon for me to check that it's not. The Ghostbusters one is a Cadillac, Hearst or Cadillac ambience, and this is just the station wagon. So can I just say the film describes these three women as quote, The little Mexican, the girl from Vienna, and the Bucksam Blond. Yes, I think that is the narrator speed that sums up. And then that is further exacerbated by the clip we're about to play. But I just want to say the thing that I thought here, so this is Shet in Hollywood and that the other parallel I made here is naive young women going to Hollywood thinking they're going to be movie stars and then having to take their clothes off in the camera, which is somewhat of an irony for for this movie to do in particular. However, I think we're got a little narrator here, so as they get into the car with Victor, after he picks them up, Victor looks so bored all the time, by the way. But anyway, as that happens, the narrator gives us this. Three new bodies, fresh live young bodies. No families of friends within thousands of miles, no one to ask embarrassing questions when they disappear. So when I say the music sounds like a cartoon, that's just a little sample of it there, it seems weird. And when we first meet the women, especially and especially I think Nina, they are walking in what I would describe as like they are like sesheng across the airport while the music keeps beat to it. So yeah, I mean, this is like, this is a trashy film. This is trashy film. Yeah, for all the credit we just tried to give this margin Victor. Yeah, it's a trashy almost immediately. they get to the house. They get all get different rooms. Anita screams almost immediately. I forget what she sees. She saw the dog man. She saw the dog man. That's right. And they're instructed by Mrs. March like, you may not leave without my permission. And she sort of immediately pushes them around. And I think Anita and Nina and Nina immediately thinks they've made a mistake yes so now she shows them to the rooms the music I put a note here that the music sounds like the Flintstones yes it does they give a need of the worst room which is really mean because it like the evaluation of these women is done very quickly by Mrs. March and she's basically like oh Anita you get the room in the basement because you were not my candidate but what what what about her turned off Mrs. March? I think she just finds her unattractive. She has a birthmark on her back. Oh, okay. So it's interesting. I mean, so some one or more of these women are here because they hoped to have a career in Hollywood and in their career prospects as the assistant to Mrs. March, they are being crassly and misogynistically evaluated according to their appearance in exactly the way that Hollywood I have to imagine. evaluates and discards women who don't meet their standards. So I don't know if the movie is trying to be smart here. I don't think it is, but yeah, no, but that sort of feels like you didn't mention that their standing in front of Mrs. March wearing only a towel and she's using our cane to poke and prod their bodies. Yes, which is part of the weird dynamic. That's what Mrs. March. Yeah, and Victor keeps coming into the room like to ogle them while this is happening. It's weird. Yeah, but we actually we start to move pretty quick here. So the first thing that happens is poor Anita Since she's been rejected she becomes the next experimental subject and who's brain does Anita get Andy in the lab? So we've got a dog man. What do we have now? So, Dr. Frank's experiments about us continue. Dr. Frank has been shown to have had a pet cat. Yes. One whose name was credited on the poster of this film. So, poor Anita rejected because of her birthmark is going to be the next experiment in transplanting. not a human brain into a human body, but an animal brain into a human body. So Dr. Frank obducks her and transplants the brain of his quote, favorite cat into Anita. And by the way, he keeps the body of the cat around, he does, which is going to be important later. And Anita starts acting like a cat, though physically, she has lost speech, she starts acting like a cat, and Dr. Frank brings, first of all, they don't really go into how the brain transplant worked. It's just sort of like two people on a table next to each other. They suggest it's a physical transplant, because at one point he's holding a brain. Yes. But there's no real surgery, you know, like none of that, nothing that you would expect I was hoping for the film to go into some dumb but enjoyable detail about the mechanics of this, but it just does not. Well, it can't, because later it's got to put a human brain in the cat's body spoiler and there's no way they could possibly happen. So if they explain it, the movie runs along pretty quickly here. So yeah, can I just click on it? I don't know if this was standard for these films, but the dialogue was of this entire movie essentially was clearly recorded separately from like the acting and was laid over the acting and it results in some really see a lot of scenes where it's really obvious that the dialogue is not the words that are coming out of the actor's mouths. So You know, it's funny about that as I just watched The Good The Bad in the Ugly, and it has a lot of people speaking Italian that are dubbed in English, but then it has American actors speaking English that are that do their own ADR the whole experience is a little it sort of detaches you from a foot the film a little bit. Yeah, it's just a slightly Uncanny experience. I think for modern film viewers, but yes, I think in this instance and if they're trying to fix the film and they only have the footage in the audio they have They will take audio from something else and put it on the new footage to try and make it make continuity happen. Can you imagine being assigned the footage of this film and you're like, you got to make this make sense. Yeah, pull this together. Yeah. Okay, carry on John. So as we move on, they, you know what we forgot to mention something earlier on John. because it is a little important to the theme of this podcast. Yes. Early in the movie, we met one of the director Frank's failures, which was a beautiful woman. Dead, it's her corpse that he tried what failed to revive and she came back mindless, right? so she is brainless and she is explicitly described as quote zombie like that's right and because she doesn't seem to have any will or anything she's allowed to just roam around the laboratory at will and this is going to become a little important later yes but she's our only sort of zombie real zombie creature we can discuss the mayor's the other people brought back to life, but actually I have a lot of thoughts about that when we get there. But too, yes. But carry on, a burial list through the rest of us. Yeah. So Nina, you've got me saying, Nina now, thanks, Andy. Yeah. She realizes that some things are miss. She tries to use the phone, the phone doesn't work. You know, they're not allowed to leave. So, As she realizes this, she explains to be what's going on and then they come up with a plan. Oh, in that zombie like woman, right, is wandering around the dogman attacks her and gets chained up. Yes. And this is witnessed by the girl. So they have to stay inside. They realize they're stuck in here with the dogman. So anyway, when they're just to be clear, they're they're stuck in here. They've tried to quit a couple of times, but this is Marcha said basically no. And interestingly, she uses their uncertain immigration status as leverage. I know, I am sad to see this was a people were being exploited in this way back in the 60s as well as the modern day. But they're trapped here because of their immigration status, and Mrs. March threatens to just report them in some of the authorities if they try to leave. But also on a more visceral level, there is a dogman chain outside the door that's going to kill them if they try to leave. Yes. So the living corpse is wandering around in the dogman assaults her. Uh, which is witnessed by the girls, the dogman that gets chained up outside, so they realize they've got a problem. Uh, and Nina gives this plan like, okay, we were trapped in here, even if we could get past, uh, even if we could get out, how would we get out of here? They come up with a plan to steal the keys to the car from Victor, and they sound like that, like, Yureka, like, this is what we'll do, so be realize that she can seduce Victor and get the keys. So this is what she then attempts to do. Yeah, so this is a, this is more sexuality than we have seen in most of our movies today by the way, the plan is explicitly to seduce Victor, which is whatever there's a problem, there's a, there's, I'll say there's a cat wrench in the plan Anita, Anita gets loose and starts hissing at the dog man. uh... from a tree and then be goes out to see what's going on and gets attacked by a need of the catwoman and gets her eye caught out by any yes uh... yeah pretty fun scene honestly because be Climbs up onto the roof where is like prowling around like it. Well, what happens first is is is there's like a gazebo kind of thing that And she claws out B's eye so B goes to the infirmary in the basement, but then but then nine a Chases and eat are around on the roof because they need a zacting like a cat If it's not obvious, I couldn't distinguish B and Nina for the entire movie. So my notes just go back and forth. Yes. So in any case, she, Anita, after a long, I put my notes here. We've got six minutes of chasing Anita around. But she eventually just falls off the roof. and dies and dies yeah and then we got we go down to the lab where B is being treated by the doctor and hey I got a clip here because A he explains what's going on scientifically like as if it makes sense but but also he gives his motivation so we get the thing about this actor is he seems so square and so normal so but here we get his mad scientist motivation yes and what's going to You think that I want to go. Let me explain. And during my no-life today, capable of restoring your friend's sight. After Alexis Perrell, who pioneered the transplanting of vital human organs, got the portion of an animal's vital life for many years. For this, you receive the Nobel Prize. of Ontario's self without a car out. He was through me. I too frightened to preserve life, and the find of means to improve the lives of future generations. Your viewpoint is at narrow, ignorant one, held by the medical society today, which forces me to work in a place like this to give into the whims of a foolish old woman, because she can supply me with a funzine to continue my work. I love that, that mad sign to speech so much. We heard it in Dr. Blood's coffin. I'm sure we're gonna hear it so many times. It's a classic. And further, I love how they get this square straight actor who's just supposed to be like the normal guy, and they try to have him do a mad sign to speech, which is also great. Yeah. We also find out at this point that he's keeping the eye alive. He has a piece eye in like this atomic cage where he's also got somebody's hand and the dead cat. right so uh so anyway can I can I just say yeah I feel very seen I only have one eye and right now is recorded I'm wearing an eye patch to hide like the gross empty eye socket where of my other eye and I was just delighted to watch this movie and see someone going through uh yeah I don't know I'm much more exciting version of my own life journey in the space of a couple minutes Yeah, B is bereft at her at the loss of her eyes and to they they have they have covered both of her eye like she only lost one of them But they've covered both they've tied a bandian there on both of her eyes, which is kind of funny It is it is a little funny, but she's so upset about this now now the so the next 10 minutes is movie Is everybody shooting themselves in the foot? Yes, so so first of all, Mrs. March says Like, Victor, if you're crazy if you think I'm going to keep you around when I'm a beautiful young woman after I've transferred my brain into her body, get out of here, and my first son is, well, tell him later. Yes, exactly, we like, wait hours, wait a day until the transfer is done. Exactly. So he gets drunk. He spills the whole thing to Nina, but he makes her shine a contract. I don't really understand what that was for. So the movie thinks this is really important. So let's try this. But I don't know why. Yeah. So she has signed over all of her wealth to Victor. Is that right? Because Nina's now going to be the subject. I skipped the part. I skipped the part where she made Nina try on a bunch of clothes. Because now Nina is the front runner instead of B because B has had her eye removed. That's right. Yeah. So it is a theme that, like as soon as you have a physical flaw, Mrs. March doesn't want you to be her new car body anymore. So we're down to Nina, even though that wasn't the first choice. So so he has her sign of contract as her protector or guardian or something. I think so. Okay. But I something. Yeah. Something that can be legally exploited by Victor later. I guess is the only. Yes. Part of it. Yeah. I think so. he's going to help her get out of there. They're going to get the car. She's going to get me. He's going to get the car. And then Miss March stabs him in the brainstem or something with a thin needle. Yeah. And he dies. It's not like shown or anything, but like your imagination conjures up something that's kind of gnarly, I would say. Yes, at which point Dr. Frank obducks 9a for the experiment. How do they do this? Oh, yeah. Dr. Frank Bursin and they object they abduct 9a by smothering here with an ether soak tanker chip. That's right. Like in Dr. Blood's cause. Like in the active led to the famous 10 second chloroform, which we actually know actually takes five. So they, you know, we see her struggling more than modern movies show. Yes. So I told the era where they like feel the slightest inclination to like towards realism. We know from our discussion of Dr. Melissa Coffin. It takes five minutes of a continual inhalation to knock somebody out with the actor. But in this case, we get a good like 15 seconds. Maybe she smokes. I don't know. It could be. Yeah. So in any case, they prepare the experiment. We've got Mrs. March on the table. We've got nine out on the table, and I wanna play the other weird self-justification speech that in this movie, but it kind of speaks to what you're talking, what we talked about at the top. So, there's incredibly wealthy woman who is a villain, and it was hatching this plan to kill three women, delivers the following self-justification modeler. You don't know what it's been like for me, knowing that any attention I received was not for me, but my money. Well, nobody got any of it. I've never known what it was like to be loved, for myself alone. What a bizarre speech. So for people. Either of these like villains and some of these speeches get you John. No, not this one for sure. Yes, because she's also incredibly shallow. It's not for herself. It's somebody else's body, and she only wants it because it's attractive, which is not quite the same as being loved for your character or spirit. I think that, I think she's got that confused, which is fine. Yes. And we do see him holding a brain at one point. Yes. But before they can transfer to Nina, but Nina never, so I like this scene, genuinely, unethnicly, because he starts the procedure, but Nina wakes up part way through. That's right. He has like brought her back out because Dr. Frank has his own agenda, which is why. That's right, he suddenly is what I put in my note. So what he does is he takes, he gets, he gets, this is March, he takes Mrs. March's brain and puts it in a cat. So, you know, my cat has a head that is smaller than my own fist. Yes. And I don't think my brain would fit in my cat's head. I don't know if he's selectively chose parts. Maybe maybe Mrs. March is really old and so your brain gets smaller. I don't know, but maybe you are just one of these people in the medical establishment that don't have any vision, John. I don't have the vision to see how he could do this, but in any case. So, uh, so this is a great ironic fate for Mrs. March, by the way. I guess in the, in our tales of the crypt, Twilight Zone, ironic bad guy getting their come up and I really enjoyed this. I actually originally pulled, I didn't want to do too many narrator clips and the narrator, hear pipes in saying, isn't it ironic for Mrs. March to be getting her, you know, going into the trash for her dinner or something along those lines? Yes. However, Mrs. March, the cat, now, now, the cat woman, the woman cat, Zerksy. And to be clear, it's like a cat. It's like, yeah, it's not like, yes, it's a cat with a human brain. when Dr. Frank goes into the atomic chamber to like prepare something. I don't even know what he's doing. She walks up to the controls that he explained at the beginning and turns out locks him in and turns on the self-destruct mechanism, which is amazing. So, Nina wants to escape. She wants to grab B, uh, we do see B's eye for a second. So B comes down. Nina still strapped to the table. B comes down. She's still got the, her eyes are bandage, but she blenders away down the lab and she frees, uh, Nina. Yes, and she and so nine of escapes. She's actually fine. I mean, she's traumatized, but she's fine. She tries to get B to escape with her, but it doesn't work. Be grabbed. What is B go back for, John? She goes back for her eye. Yes. And the whatever the tragic. Yes. So nine out of see it passed the dog man, which she does. She runs out into the night. How do they get past the dog man? I forget. I think they just skip past it. I think they just get past it. Yeah. And then she runs out into the night, the house explodes in fire, which is not how atomic explosions work, but that's okay. The cat escapes as well. and the end of the and the narrator tells us how this all ends up or at least the future for Xerxes the cat now Mrs. March and nine a who is still nine a somehow but rich This is much did not intend to let her money get out of sight she would follow that girl sometime someplace revenge would come That's good so can we just can we just in my own in my own little head cannon that this is the that the maker of it follows saw this film and yes, it was like that's it that's the movie I want to make exactly so like am I wrong though, I mean it is this hour first it's finally over or is it like a lot of the end of yeah uh i think it might be over the ones we've seen i think so so yeah whoo that was quite a ride uh it's as silly as it all sounds and certainly mst three k worthy um yeah do we want to just jump into it yes let's do it let me pull up our wrap-up questions john john in monstrosity is there a hero party Yeah, I think the three women constitute a hero party. Yeah, I think they make up a perfectly respectable hero party. Yeah. How do they do how many survive? Not so good. Only out of this whole group, only 9a and a cat with a human brain survived. Yeah, so Anita gets a cat brain put in her and falls over roof. And be tries to go back like lots of wife for her eye and is electrocuted. So only 9a survives. That's right. All right, so let's talk about the zombie or zombies in this film John. First of all, who would you define as the zombie or zombies in this film? This is a tough one. I think it's only the second subject, the corpse that was robbed from the grave at the beginning of the film because I don't think they say they've put any brain in her. you write she specifically has no brain she's right functioning by like just pure physiological instinct or something now now i would make a case also that the animal the dogman is kind of a zombie because he has that feral zombie vibe he knows and he's definitely dead and brought back to life so i think it's important like the first couple of these creatures are on dead. Yes, with different attributes. And in fact, I mean, depending on how seriously you want to take the dialogue, I think what we are. Andy, I don't want to take it seriously at all, but carry on. What's the problem? You're in the wrong the problem with Dr. Frank's experiments is that the body, the brain's decay too fast. So what he actually wants is a living still living subject for the brain to be transplanted into. Right. So I do think we do kind of technically wind up with two different types of zombies. We have zombies created. We have zombies that started as corpses that were reanimated in some way. and then we have the intended zombie of this movie was going to be like a living corpse just be raft of its free will right so right but I think the most true zombie is yeah the the early in the movie corpse woman who's roaming around the lab and gets just unceremoniously killed by the dog man that was like what a What a dumb way to dispose of your zombie, but yeah, so our two zombies kill each other, actually, which is a little weird. Yeah. All right, so how are speaking of that? How are zombies destroyed or killed is this movie? So in this movie, the zombies are not superhuman in any way, as far as I could tell, like I think the dogman just like kills her. Yeah, I think he just mulls her or something like that. Yeah. Is the world threatened in the monstrosity? I don't think so. I mean, there's crime going on here, but I don't think there's some master plan. I think after Mrs. March got her brain translated, she'd be happy to be done, you know? Yes, I think this is another story with a really hyper-local focus that's based on people's petty desires and grievances. Exactly. All right, let's see, what type of zombie strain would you say we're dealing with here? I think we're dealing with science created zombies, there's no mysticism here at all, they're just mad scientists zombies. Yep, how fast are the zombies? Are they subhuman speed regular human speed or are they fast? So they take on the attributes of the creature who's brain they have. So in the case of the woman, no brain, she lumbars around like a class exam be where their cat woman leaps around and climbs buildings and stuff. So they vary. Yes. How degrading do you think it was to be the cat woman zombie in this movie? Just like, you know, even though the movie came out later, when we talked about the frozen dead, There's two women cast in one of them's like, well, you're going to be the lead and you are going to be the head on the table. I feel like the same thing happened here to Anita's actress who plays Anita liked. Two of you are going to play attractive women who are fought over for their beauty. And you, you get turned to a cat person. You know, like, yes. Alright, so John, let's talk about your four pillars of the zombie genre. Yes, John, in monstrosity is there and apocalypse. There's not. Is there contagion? No, you have to get it to process. It's a whole thing. Are there tough moral choices? I don't think so. I mean, the villains just do villainous things again. They're not moral. And people like Nina and B do want to rescue each other and save each other. So there's no, you know, there's no tough to, you know, Nina would have waited for B if B hadn't killed herself. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. All right, lastly, are loved ones turning against you in this movie. Um, you could argue that Xerxes the cat turns on the doctor as a zombie cat that's true. So technically yes, but not in the spirit intended spirit of the question. You could also say the Anita. Yeah, it's a stretch to say that she's a loved one. Right. But, uh, she does, you know, fight back in a cat like way against the against B or Yeah, I think I'd just like to point out at this point, I feel like though we know because we know the future in a sense that 1968 sort of brings all these pillage together. And this is what we've been moving towards. I feel like they're further away as far away as they have been at any other time agreed in this podcast. I feel like in even 30s and 40s movies, we were like, hey, there's a little bit of a apocalypse here. Would you see that zombie hoard in the corner? Or, you know, like technically, it was contagious. You know, we could make those arguments and there's none of that in the last couple movies. Yeah, I tend to agree like this is very far away. This is a weird little off-shoot or something right my last question though, John, if I turn it over to you, is did the movie poster sell this film accurately? Um, yes, because it had a cat and some scantily-cled women on it, and I think, yes, with the film. And that's the entirety of the film. Yes, correct. All right, John. Now as your turn to ask me a couple questions, I think. Yeah, so we're going to stick with our 1950s questions for one more week, even though we did come up with our 1960s questions last episode. But as this movie was made in 58, and actually before I knew that, I did put a note in my notes. It said, wow, this feels like a throwback to the 50s. So we'll stick with those questions this time. So it's paranoia, a major theme, hypocrisy, dark secret. So those present in this, maybe? And not really accept that there's some like suggested setup for paranoia in the idea that Mrs. March that the beautiful woman you're talking to might be a creepy old creepy old woman who transplanted her brain. But I can't say that this really hits those themes. No, no. However, movie heroes change are their younger, less professional. So I will say, yes, on this one, yeah, this does meet our 1950s guesses that we'd see younger, more professional protagonists. These are three women, they are young, and they are, I guess, I mean, they're vulnerable, right? They have uncertain jobs. they have uncertain immigration status, they are taking a crap job in the hopes of one day turning it into a better opportunity in the future. Like when we hear that they want to do them have plans for Hollywood. But but they've got to start here at the at the very bottom right being a assistant to this woman and that feels on a par with what we saw in what was in man eater or woman eater. I'm sorry. Yep. Where you had people were feeling more willing to show just like kind of degrading jobs that that real people actually work in. Yes. So I'm going to say that's a yes. Yep. Okay. How about science and sci-fi? Do they take on a new role in zombie movies here? Well, I will say, I mean, so the film is clearly trying to hook into the excitement of medical transplant technology. Yes. It doesn't do it in any real interesting way, except to say, ooh, what if this was weird and scary? Yeah, it does the same thing with atomic power, right? Yeah, exactly, exactly. And does we leave our local roots and move on to the broader world stage? I mean, no. Well, this is a really American story, I think, and it is, I think I would say it is a Hollywood story. Yes. This is a movie about wealth and beauty as we, as kind of pop culture and specifically Hollywood, talk about them. Right. That is, I mean, I'm being really generous to this film by saying it, the value we put on women and the way we assign that value based on their bodies, right? Yep. So yeah, I will say that this has left its local roots. It has nothing to do with Haiti or Voodoo or anything like that. This is a pretty Los Angeles sort of story to tell. Alright, so John, I have a couple final questions as we reach the very end of this episode. John, would you and I survive in the zombie world of monstrosity? So we were talking about this last time and I was told, I think rightly, that I'm not allowed to use the excuse that I'm not dumb enough to get sucked into something like this. So if we've set that excuse aside, if I was in that house and Mrs. March saw how useless I was, she would definitely order me killed by somebody. I would probably be an experimental subject. if Mrs. Mars were to poke and prod you, would she want to put her brain in your body? No, I don't, I hope not, God. I mean, if it's, well, I know, between the three of us, are we the three girls? Yes, Nina, okay. I feel, I like my chances a little better than, but there's no accounting for taste, I guess. I imagine that's, that is just very interesting, because I imagined that we would be the victor in this story, right? So the real question is, if your wife could go into the body of like a 22 year old, would she ditch you instantly, or would you keep you around? Yes, she would ditch you instantly. Yeah, there's no way that I come out that I survive here, that I'm going to get out. I don't think I make it out of this one regardless of which character you imagine. Yeah, except for, I don't know, maybe that no, the doctor even. I thought fall for it, you know, he thought he had all the power and he got killed by his own cat who had old lady's brain in it. The problem with everybody in this movie is that they tell their plans to everybody else, but they still keep going along as if they hadn't just done that. Yeah, they spill the beans like a little too early. Everyone does it. Yeah. He should have taken the brain and the test the I do it and put it in a jar and left Mrs. March there. That would have been, that's a good movie. Yeah. I would challenge the idea that that would be a good movie, John, but you know, it would be a better movie. Yes. All right. Let's see, John, is this a zombie movie or is this a movie with zombies? It is a movie that barely has zombies in it. Yes, I would agree. I will say these the one traditional zombie has looks and moves and acts like a pretty good song. Yes, like I give it my seal of approval but it has such a cursory role and it's just disposed of by the plot in such an anti-climactic way. Yeah, I agree with you. Yeah, I feel like we're trading water here on the zombie stuff in this month. Yeah, This is really more of like a Dr. Moro's island type of yes or that that like the horror it's going for is Dr. Moro's island not zombies so correct all right and lastly John do you recommend this movie first as a general movie that everyone should run out and watch with their significant other on date night and secondly do you recommend this specifically to our I know you think this is a simple answer, but the way it framed it. So first of all, I'm going to say, I do think this is a simple answer. So I can't wait to hear what comes out. You're trying to get your partner to dump you because if that's the case, then yes, you would want to watch this on movie night. Now, however, assuming that it's not the case, no, also for zombie fans, no, however, there's a third option that you forgot, Nandy, you should watch this movie on MST3K. Oh, of course. You know, you may need to start adding that as a third option going forward. So yes. Like, here is like a Valentine's day dare for you, like tell your significant other that you really want them to watch your favorite movie in the whole world and then show them this and see what they do, like, and then email us to tell us. Yeah, please, that'd be great. From from the divorced settlement as it played. Yeah, so. Yes. Okay. Well, I don't even remember where you landed, but no double know I just could watch it on MS-23. Yeah, you know you shouldn't watch this. No, it doesn't really give us anything new about zombies. If you like, there is a parallel podcast out there's somewhere of like, you know, Island Dr. Murrow inspired her. Like, it's our next podcast. Maybe you would find some value if you like human animal hybrid horror. But that's the only niche audience I could ever recommend this film. It is interesting that it's similar to the Revive Monster where it pulls in so many different genre groups from different types of horror movies. That's the other show that has like a Frankenstein element, it has a mad scientist element, it has a zombie element. And I think this then would be had a lot more heart than this one, yes, you know, had sympathetic characters and and all the stuff. This movie does not have, but yeah, so would you say, do you think based on the movies we watch so far? Do you think that by 1963 is there such a thing as a quote zombie movie yet? It's interesting because there have been movies we've seen called the zombies of Moritao and white zombie like the word is used, but they're all over the place. So I don't think so, not quite yet because those zombies are still everywhere. In the 60s, I mean, if you saw the word zombie in the title of the movie or on the poster, would you have any idea what sort of film you were getting into if you went to the theater? I think all you would know is it's a scary movie, because you could get, you could get what's the, what's the serial we watched with the Martian Invaders. Zombies of the stratosphere. Zombies of the stratosphere, you could get this movie or you could get zombies of more a town. And that last one does feel like what we consider zombie movie. So I guess I guess that my point still stands is that I don't think it'd be a clear picture yet. Yeah, I do, I think all it conveys is this is going to be like a scary or creepy film. Yeah, I think if it conveyed anything, it was early on where it sort of had this voodoo implication now, it really doesn't mean anything yet. Oh, that's an interesting, because it did have a meaning, right? Voodoo and didn't notice this in all this kind of stuff. Now, you might think there's mindless creatures and stuff, but if you take zombies of the stress, or those aren't mindless, they're just aliens. You know? Yeah. So I think it had a meaning, it's lost its meaning, and I think we're moving towards the new meaning. Yeah, that's a fascinating point, John. All right. I do think whether or not there are zombie films, I do think people know what zombie means. There is a consensus about a zombie. Yes, that's true. But all the movies called zombie movies don't don't share that much. Do you hate it? Yeah. All right. So, hey, guys, it is time. We have finally reached the scariest part of every episode. And that is where producer Brad reveals to me and John, what we will be watching for the next episode. So, uh, John, do you want to like quick, quick prediction? Are we due for a good one or bad one? Um, I am worried we're going to stick on a rough streak here. So let's find out kind of a, I went into the 60s pretty excited and optimistic, but I, that is dim somewhat. So let's, let's see what we got. Well, the good news is we're going to 1964. So we're moving. Okay. More modern age if that means anything. And here's the poster for our next film. I'm pausing for impact. Whoa. Oh, yes. Okay. The incredibly strange creatures who stopped living and became mixed up zombies, which, by the way, is a musical. So, okay. So, just to be clear, is the name of this movie, the incredibly strange creatures who stopped living and became mixed up zombies? It is. Yes. Yes. Okay. Well, let's describe this poster. The most prominent. There's two things on it. One is a big zombie. Look ahead. It looks like a decayed corpse. One eye is closed and one eye is open and kind of gross. Yeah. And converting in front of it is a scantily clad woman in a yellow outfit of some sort. She's she's a rocket. She's a dancer. Yes, she. Okay. Yeah. I apologize if I just and it says the first monster musical yes he says see the dancing girls of the carnival murdered by the incredible night creatures of the midway see the hunchback of the midway fight a duel of death with the mixed up zombies see the first monster musical filmed in terror ramma and Eastman color The marketer in me is saying that is a little too much copy. We need to trim that down. We've lost some of the punch about anyone, John, that you see as far as like names or people involved, did you want to call it? What does that picture in the bottom left? Is that a guy like stabbing a woman in the face? Sort of looks like. It kind of looks like the red skull from Marvel with that toothy grin that might be a zombie that might be a series of me. It starts in one named cash flag. So I'm not familiar with cash's work. It introduces Carolyn Brandt. It doesn't ring a bell yet. So I think, um, this either started ended or did both to a balada careers will find so this looks like a parody right yeah I don't know anything about this movie I haven't seen the musical I don't I've never seen this movie before is does it look to you like it's a satire of the genre I don't know because I've been aware of this movie, but I've never seen it, and so I don't know. Okay. The title does not make it seem serious to me. No. We have had two, well, we have had more than two, actually, but we have had two really blatant zombie comedy films. Right. We've had the Ghost Breakers, and we've had the Game of Thrones and zombies on Broadway. So we've had several comedies. Yes. If I were to guess, I think this might be our first like satire of the genre, rather than like a vehicle for like gags. Right. Right. So I guess we'll see. Yes, all right. I'm excited. And this is the film. This is the film Joseph Muskelli did this in a topography for so a tractor from our current film and straw city worked on this one. Wait, is this in color? It's an Eastman color. It says color. Yeah. I got, I'm sorry. It was overwhelmed by the terror ramma that I forgot about the Eastman color part. What's happening in the top right of the izombie's head? Somebody is abducting a woman, I think. I don't know biting her like top of the head. I don't know whoever just like laid out this poster made some interesting choices Yeah, it's kind of psychedelic. The moon is like a green dot with swirls around it. It's And that zombie that you pointed out there. He's wearing a touch similar to the dead one that sort of freely old-style tuxedo. Yes, yeah, so all right. Well, it's on We'll see you next episode For the incredibly strange creatures who stopped living it became mixed up zombies You've been listening to zombie strains. We'll be back next episode to talk about another zombie movie. If you enjoyed our podcast, please take a moment to rate us in your podcast Apple Choice. Tell a friend, follow us on Instagram at zombie strains. All of this helps like-minded people find the show. See you next time.